How Do Alcoholics Manipulate Others

Manipulating AlcoholicI don’t think that alcoholics are consciously aware of how they selfishly manipulate others. I’ve heard so many reformed problem drinkers express remorse for how they acted during the days when they were at their worst. Having been addicted to alcoholic myself and having lived with several addicts, I understand what some of the ways are that substance abusers manipulate others.

Blaming
Substance abusers will play the blame game in order to get people to feel guilty. Problem drinkers blame others for their problems all of the time. The person being put down will oftentimes do things for the alcoholic in an effort to win their approval. The more the addict points the finger at someone the harder that someone will try to make the substance abuser happy. Most of what you are being blamed for isn’t your fault. So, don’t let them get you down.

Arguing
Addicts us anger as a manipulative force all of the time. Here again, we get caught in this place where we want to get along with the alcoholic, but no matter how hard we try, they always are upset with us about something. Refuse to argue with them!

Problem Drinker Manipulating Through GuiltSelf Pity
Poor little old Jimmy, life has just dealt him a horrible set of circumstances. He can’t pay his rent because someone stole his wallet. He needs to borrow money for groceries. He bounced three checks because his boss hasn’t paid him in two weeks. He needs someone to take him to work because he overslept again. If he walks to work, his boss is going to fire him because he’s been late three times this week already. Stop being an enabler and let the alcoholic suffer the consequences of his/her actions. Don’t let the alcoholic manipulate you through making you feel sorry for them.

Creating A Sense Of Urgency
Can I please have an advance on my paycheck? I’m three months behind on my water bill and they are going to turn it off today. Can you come pick me up right away? I missed the bus because I looked at the wrong time slot. If I don’t get to this job interview on time, I might not get the job. If you say no, the alcoholic may get angry, a manipulative technique. Have you ever heard the saying, “bad planning on your part doesn’t constitute an emergency on my part”. We don’t have to feel guilty when saying no to an alcoholic.

Alcoholic Liars
They will bend the truth or just flat out lie in order to manipulate people into doing things for them.

Not Answering The Phone
The only thing I can think of here is I was with an alcoholic once who had left his kids with his mom to baby sit. He was supposed to pick them up at 5 in the afternoon. He decided he wanted to stay at the bar and party for a couple of more hours. So, he turned off his phone. His mom had no idea where he was or what to do with his kids. He knew that she wouldn’t tell him she wouldn’t watch the grand kids again because of what he had done because she loved spending time with them.

There are just countless ways that alcoholics manipulate others. I think the trap we have to be careful not to fall into is continually trying to win the alcoholic’s love and approval. The worse they treat us the harder we try to make them happy. We cannot make them happy so stop trying to. Consider working on making your own life happy instead through letting go of the problem drinker and enjoying your own life.

We also have to make up our minds that we will not allow the problem drinker to make us feel guilty. Don’t be manipulated through guilt. We have to see the truth in situations. Most of the things the alcoholic tries to blame us for have nothing to do with anything we have done wrong.

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Alcoholic Relationship Solutions
Alcoholic Making Me Feel Guilty
Leaving An Alcoholic

70 comments to How Do Alcoholics Manipulate Others

  • Amy

    Mine tries all of these…I am catching on..lol…I use to fall for all of them…He loves to blame me for his drinking…then as time went on I also seen he blamed the neighbor,work,stress,etc,,after I caught on to this it doesn’t get to me anymore…I just say it that right..I am aware they use anger..I am also aware I fall for it A LOT..lol..I need a lot of work in this area..but I have made some improvements..He doesn’t play the self pity care to much..I think he tries that one when he feels guilty about his drinking..I use HIS guilty feelings against him now and take advantage of them..rather it be things we need,,things I want..work around the yard..and it works..GOOD THING..we would never get anything from him if it didn’t!…He has tried making me feel guilty,it doesn’t work..when you see someone try the same tactics over and over a million times..you tend to catch on..and LIES he LIES a lot..he lies to get out of housework, lies about why he didn’t or couldn’t get something done around here.LIES, LIES,LIES..I have figured a lot of them out, seeing he lies about the same things all the time..I am sure he lies about A LOT of things, but if they don’t affect me..lie away..he lies about the stupidest things..I use to go behind him and do all the things he was suppose to do or have done..( Wanna talk about being exhausted)..it took me ALONG time to figure out the reason NOTHING was being done is simply because when I go to work he doesn’t do anything..sit on the couch wait for the store to open go get alcohol then get drunk..so I LEAVE his stuff HIM..I have seen it take him up to 5 days to get the dishes done..but he is catching on that he can either do them or the pile will get bigger and bigger..if he makes any messes when I am not here..on the counters, floors..etc.as he always does..I tell him when he wakes up..he needs to clean them all up…he does but boy does he do a lot of sighing..but like I said he is figuring out he can either do it or it will stay that way..I am not going to clean up after a messy drunk..Now that I am aware of the tactics they use my life has become a lot easier…when I look back on the past..I honestly can’t believe how much he took advantage or me …I was doing all my responsibilities and HIS TOO…time makes you wise I guess..lol

  • Debbi

    Amy & others:

    I’m curious if anyone had any of these tactics used on them.

    1.Hinting that other women like him & talk to him (maybe true or not).

    2. Planting or purposely leaving items out that you will find to upset you & seems like it’s to purposely start an argument.

    3. Telling you that mutual friends don’t like you any more &/or telling the mutual friends lies of things you did not say.

    4. Gossip–very secretly getting information & curious about everyone else’s business (then mine would use against me & maybe others).

    5. Never raise voice to me but softly call me names. Anger only showed in actions–smashing items, etc. Seems to delight in getting me upset where I would argue & raise my voice & then he would sit back stone-faced and say nothing.

    I never saw my A fully drunk or passed out–he actually seemed to be an expert at hiding everything & I mean everything.

    Any thoughts?

  • Amy

    Mine USE to do that..He cheated on me in the past and I left him for two years..after two years we ended up back together…(wasn’t that a bright idea on my part!)…When he is really drunk and mad he says things like Ive got to go find myself a good woman..I tell him good luck with that!..Door is over there go find on!e…He says things like I should of stayed with so and so..I have had better woman than you..he hasn’t said any of it in awhile..I think he figured out he wasn’t getting to me..Like I always say..I take it from where it comes..A drunk who gets up and starts drinking at 8, makes a complete ass of himself, and comes off as a complete idiot.and hangs out in the yard..or sits in the truck alone all day drunk listening to music, or hides in the basement and drinks..then usually passes out by 5 is not a prize,,I don’t think anyone is going to be clawing the walls down to be with him…If my Alcoholic..(Dana)..I’m sorry I am tired of writing alcoholic his name is Dana..is drinking..he will find anything he can to fight about..I seriously think he scrounges around here trying to find something to fight about..one night it was cereal..I kid you not cereal,,You know when your down to scrounging about something to fight about when you start a fight about cereal…good grief!!!!. We don’t have any mutual friends..I might talk to the people he associates with but that’s about it. I do know he tells them its all my fault he drinks etc..I don’t think he paints a pretty picture of me, but seeing they don’t know anything about alcoholics or the things they do..I’m more than sure they feed into it..and to be honest I could really care less..those people are nothing to me…I actually told him one day to go find someone to whine to about how bad you have it and blame me and anyone else you can find for the one million reasons you drink…I really don’t want to hear this crap anymore..The only reason I cant think of a reason he hasn’t used for his drinking..you would think after awhile they would run out of reasons and people to blame lol…Gossip…I think mine makes up his gossip when he is drunk to start a fight he will say someone came here today and told me..(this this and this,I also heard you were cheating one me Amy)..my response.Is that right…I don’t even bother with the foolishness most of the time..if your quiet or leave the room, or go outside for even 5 minutes..the fool is usually so drunk he cant even remember what he was talking about…I have actually left a room and he was trying to fight with me ,,came in 5 minutes later and he is all lovey dovey…I just stand there thinking..this is is NUTS!!,,Dana hollers..there is no doubt about that…there is no softly going on here..but you know what when I see all the things you wrote…it seems he is trying to get to you, trying to make you jealous..trying to bring you down, make you feel bad..and the not hollering but saying it softly…it seems like a form of manipulation..It seems like he is trying to get to you the same way they all do..just going about it a different way..I try to reverse things and put myself in he shoes or someone else doing the action…Oh Dana LOVES to smash things..he has smashed two computers…rips things off the walls..etc..but you know what the less I confront him..the less I let him get to me…the less I confront and argue with him when he is drinking the less he erupts..I am doing the best I can to do the things JC says to do on this site…I’m not perfect at it but I am learning..I think I have read everything on here twice…lol…but I am finding my life has a whole lot more peace in it and a whole lot less chaos doing the things JC says to do…than when I was doing it my way and trying to control and alcoholic…

  • Julie

    I so needed to read this today. Even after our divorce mine is still trying to use these tactics on me. And when i try to distance myself or not respond to him i allow myself to feel guilty. But this is something i am used to feeling and i am working on this. Trying to stay focused on myself and the children and let him take care of himself.So hard to break the old habits of falling into the pattern that my A exH created with me thru 21 years of marriage. But support like this helps lots. And Debbi mine has used and is using all the above from your list to get me to pay attention to him and to tell me to take him back. I keep telling myself. he is lying…his lips are moving.
    Godspeed to everyone going through this!

  • Debbi

    Thanks Amy & Julie for your responses. I struggle with whether mine was a true A or not. Julie it was good to hear you were manipulated in the same manner–that so helps me & reassures me it was the alcohol behind it & not me as it hurts my self esteem something horribly. Mine never asked me to take him back, never apologized for horrible & often illegal things he did to me. I keep hoping one day I will finally be able to confront him & let him know that I know all along about the dirty low down things he was doing behind my back in secret. Sure hope I get my chance some day.. . .

  • Laura

    It is so hard to try and stay sane. I find myself over obsessing about him all the time. My thoughts are always about him and I am training my mind and heart to stop those thoughts as they enter in my mind and change it to be about me instead. One time I counted and in just a few seconds I thought of him and what he wants, needs and or likes over 15 times. Crazy how they want us to do everything and more for them and it never is enough. What happens I become weak and let my needs go and then that makes him feel empowered because he knows I do not feel good or happy about the way I have changed my life for him and not focusing on me, so it gives him the power and then I get said and quite, just what the wants me to be weak and unhappy. That is sick. Last night I tried to talk about hospice and went nuts and also said he might as well put a gun to his head because of me wanting to set up hospice. Two doctors told us both to do it. He just keeps drinking and not taking care of preparing for the future. The house is still not been handled it is his inheritence, but has not yet been turned over to him and I said I hope his greedy sister will give me the time to get the items out that he wants other to have and remove the animals and he went crazy and told me I was a gold digger….. how did that get turned around. I told him I was okay without a home, I just was concerned about all I will have to take care. His sister has always been a problem and his dad had several attorney meeting before he passed to make sure she could not spend my mother in-laws money, so it is obvious what we are dealing with and she still thinks of this as her family home.. I am trying to do the best I can with preparing for that horrible time and he blames me for everything. he make me question myself as to weather I am making all of this up .. crazy. He is the one that drank himself to the point of now dying and somehow this is my fault. He still drinks.. Trying to stay sane in an insane life.

  • Debbi

    Laura:
    Please be gentle on yourself right now. It is no wonder you find yourself obsessing about him–the drinking, the anger at you, his illness & hospice. I am surprised you are functioning as well as you are. You may have to deal with the house, animals and your move on your own and contact the actual owner of the house as he is/cannot deal with that now & mentioning anything to him gets him upset & ultimately you too. He is lucky to have you there with him. I don’t understand why they do that to the very ones who are standing right there beside them and helping them. I guess it’s the old saying “they hate the one that they love the most”. I wish you the best but your situation is very difficult. It’s hard for you not to let him manipulate you right now with what is going to happen to him. You are in a very difficult place right now so be very easy and gentle on yourself & make sure to take good care of YOU right now too! This will be difficult–probably the most difficult thing you will ever have to do in your lifetime. It’s okay to obsess right now. I too obsess and I’m not anywhere close to what you are dealing with. God Bless–you are in my prayers.

  • Cecelia

    I just went to the best Alanon meeting.. Sharing with others and learning from their example can help make this most frustrating disease easier to deal with. This blog and my meetings has helped me so much! Keecing back! Thanks Jay!

  • Deb

    Dear Debbi,

    My alcoholic loves to cause me pain. At first I thought he was just a sadist. Then I realized that..he’s an alcoholic. There’s a screw loose in these folks. They have a nose for power, like no one I’ve ever seen..even psychic. When you get angry, sad..low..they ‘feed off of if.’ It empowers them, boosts their mood and literally ‘their energy goes up’ and its very visible. You need to protect…YOU! Which means you have to learn ‘not to care.’ This is so hard, it really is but REMEMBER they picked YOU. They saw that YOU are a CARING person…they identified YOU as someone with COMPASSION, EMPATHY and figured you ‘are what they want.’ An alcoholic will not select a no-bullshit person, they picked you. GOOD people are targets of folks like this. And, there is Nothing to feel guilty about.

    GOOD people have learning to do. GOOD people have ‘an important spiritual’ growth step to take and only an ALCOHOLIC can give it to you (is what I figure…goes for me too). They are great fun..for you, in one way. ‘YOU’ get to take an amazing look at the deeper parts of yourself you never wanted to know about. At first it seems horrible, but after a while, ‘what a wonderful thing it is!’ It really is. ‘YOU’…to ACQUIRE…this WONDERFUL LESSON…must learn how to deal with the alcoholic.

    IT will take every ounce of your character to do so. You’ll fail and fall. You’ll try one thing and fail..again. You’ll feel sad even if its not in your character to do so and there can be times you want to..do things you never should. REMEMBER one thing ‘you are learning, you are growing, even if it doesn’t seem like it. YOU are SOBER and AWAKENED and it may be a painful lesson, but ‘you are ..moving forward.’ They are not. Even if there was a chance for an ALCOHOLIC to learn something, they can’t because their brain will forget it, there is no continuity of life when they are ‘altered so often. YOU…alone..will GAIN..from the relationship.

    LEARN…to do..’whatever you need to do’…for your own PEACE. Make that Happen. You’ll have pain…you’ll lose it at times and he will gain the upper hand. But only in that moment because in the long haul…He’s too outta it to GAIN anything. And, don’t feel sorry for him. The amount of MERCY he shows you should be the amount of MERCY you show him and I already know… HE WILL SHOW YOU NO MERCY. So, set your boundaries, set your goals and..’learn to float him along’…if you want him along. (They can be useful)

  • Laura

    Deb, Thank your for your words of tenderness. I had a long talk to my daughter today and tried to get some clarity for myself to learn why I chose this and what in me needs to change to make sure that for the rest of my life I try to always put myself first and do the best I can at taking care of my needs and not staying in the pattern of always being worried like a mother for him. I used to have a home, great financial security, wonderful job and great social a supportive people in my life. When I married him over 11 years ago I moved 4 hours away, sold my home and lost my scense of self in this little tiny gossipy town. My old work also would not let me leave so they set me up with a satelite office and paid me great money as long as I went once a month for meeting and certain events once in awhile. He did not like it and after 3 months told me to quit as we did not need the money nor did we need to be apart. Boy I bought into that one hook line and sinker. As time went on the money and controll over everything got worse as I had signed a prenuptual when were married….. His dad and mom gave us two businesses when he was alive and made it very clear he only did that because he never wanted his first wife in the business but wanted me to be a part of it and be there to run things when he(my father in-law) was gone. Guess what my husband has a clause that any gifting or inheritence is to stay in his name only…. So instead of opening a new LLC for both of us which at the corp meeting his attorney told him to do and have it for both of us, he put them in his LLC only. Funny how they always can figure out how to take care of themselves somehow and get what they want. So it all just sucks. Now he has got debts happening on some businesses and other things and I may be stuck with them even though I am not on them. I jsut have to give up and relize I will be fine no matter what and what is going to happen will happen. I thank you all for listening and find this so helpful. I am going to go to a movie by myself tonight and have a break from it all. God Bless us all, L

  • Debbi

    To Deb: Thank you so much for your kind words & reminding me I should feel no guilt. I divorced him when I realized he put family ahead of even getting me to a surgery that would save my life & tried to pull the health insurance away several times. So now is guilt because during the year of divorce I had to learn to take care of me & focused on me or I would not have survived my surgery. It is over now & I guess now I am seeking answers because if he drank that much to cause his behavior how on earth could he have been so smart & cunning to pull off all the legal & nasty maneuvers he did for years & I did not see it until almost 15 years later. Now I may be facing breast cancer with no insurance & still his family & friends rally around him & support him–I’ll bet they think I died from the last surgery he never bothered to show up for.

    To Laura: You gave up things like me also. I sold my nice little home & moved in with him. He cost me my son, every one of my friends–everyone believed him over me. I just want the truth to come out–not revenge. Maybe you also feel the same way but we are GOOD people like Deb says & we should never forget that.

  • Laura

    Debbi, I meant to write to you on my entry but put Deb. I am so sorry to hear of your pain and illness. I think part of all sickness is caused by us internilizing our pain. I hope and pray for you that things go well and the out come is a good one. I am sorry you have no one there to rely on. Is it possible to find a cancer support group maybe with some ladies who can be there for you? I do not know if you are into this sort of stuff, but there are some great books or u tube videos by Dr. Depok Chopra, Wayne Dyer and Louise Haye. They have helped me through the years. Louise had cancer too. She was broke and broken and had cancer. She survived, started her own business Haye House Publishing and is now like 80+ years old. Her words and wisdom really hit home with me. It may be a comfort to you and has very good positive words. She also has a website. Dr. Depok has alot of information for Eastern medicine ways and foods. I wish you all the best and I hope your life grows full and rich with love and joy, you deserve it. Oh my movie was good, he asked if he could go and just no I need some time for me. Dealt with Dr.s on the phone for him yesterday as he is taking medicine he is not supposed to. I decided he needs Hospice and I need to let go. He will not listen to anything with the booze in him. We are not really talking and I am enjoying my peace of mind today. Please stay in touch with updates. I am sending you best wishes and will be praying for you. L

  • Nancy

    My alcoholic and all his drinking buddies are very good at trying to make their significant other jealous. They talk about; each others wives, watching porn(what they do while watching it),other women from their past. All very disturbing.
    Yesterday my A got pulled over by a female cop for not wearing a seat belt.(I was with him) Geez, even the female cop wanted him, lol. His drunken buddies just fed off that: did she have on tight pants, did she have big boobs. 3 of us wives were sitting there while they were talking about this, I finally just told them they were stupid. How totally stupid and immature.
    NO RESPECT.

  • Nancy

    GOSSIP: Oh how my A and his buddies thrive on this. There is always one “buddy” they find to gossip about. The same thing over and over. If you are the buddy who isn’t there drinking with them, you are getting talked about, or their wives.
    The drunker they get, the more secrets that are revealed about about one another.
    I don’t know how much the others embellish, but I know my A embellishes a lot.
    I also want to say that sometimes it is hard not to get caught up in all of it. That is something I am working on for myself.

  • Debbi

    Nancy: I too endured the gossip & when he couldn’t find any more to spread about me to his family & friends he made it up–horrible lies.

    Laura: Glad you got out to the movies–what did you see? I appreciate your suggestions & used to watch Deepak & others when I had cable. The Oprah had a lifetime program on every mon night & brought all these people on to help others deal with their issues & included live twitter feeds. I wish I had cable to watch it again. My health story is getting worse by the minute. Yesterday ultrasounds revealed that again this stupid hospital & medical imaging place has screwed up with me yet again–they’ve been watching the wrong breast and so now the plot thickens. Not eligible for charity care or the CEDE program run by the state so the collection notices are starting to roll in. I have decided to place it all in God’s hands since it looks like I never had any control over it anyway no matter how hard I tried. Selling off any decent furniture, pitching the rest. Will move closer to family and see if that state has better program to help me. Still need to find a horse a home. You are in my prayers & hoping a higher power watches over both of us

  • Bill

    Nancy, it sounds like there are several addictions at work in the circle of friends.

    I’ve often wondered why the alcoholic has a tendency to try and make me feel jealous. It’s not like she doesn’t get enough attention from me. I have certainly learned how to love her without conditions. Yet, she still does and says things that I can tell are direct attempts to make me jealous.

    As long as I am confident that she isn’t cheating on me, I’ll be just fine. I did read on this site once that most alcoholics are already being unfaithful because they are more in love with the bottle than they are with their significant others. I can see that that is true at times.

    I do know that I am jealous of how much she would rather drink than spend time with me. It causes me to indirectly beg for more of her attention. I find myself trying to manipulate her to spend more time with me. It’s strange how my behavior is manipulated through her being more attached to the bottle than being attached to me and even odder how I try to manipulate her.

    This is the sort of behavior that this site has helped me become aware of…how I am reacting to what the alcoholic is doing all of the time. I suppose that’s the core of it all, as long as we instinctively react to what the alcoholics in our lives are doing, we are being manipulated by them.

    Seems, like the answer is detachment!

  • Sarah

    wow I love reading all the comments I have learned so much by visiting this site and reading all the information
    everyone contributes! I am very new to this… I have a new person in my life who suffers with this disease!
    I never realized how sick they really are! I hope I have the patience and love to get through this!
    I agree with the Detachment part….. It has helped me so much to go back to my life and my feelings and stop trying to manipulate the alcoholic. But my self first!
    Thanks so much for the support it really has given me new hope and much respect for people who deal directly with someone suffering with this sickness!

    In Love and Light
    Sarah

  • Bruce

    Bill: I went through the same things. I noticed my alcoholic girlfriend loved the bottle and pills as much or more then me. The bottle and pills won. They took her life at 38. It is so sad to watch the one you love die before your eyes. The sad thing is there is nothing you can do about it. It’s all up to them to stop. To everyone on this site. I wish you well. You have a very long road ahead of you. All of you are in my prayers. Bruce

  • Laura

    my heart goes out to all of you. It is amazing how many people are affected by this dis-ease as Dr Dyer calls it. Just look at how many of us at some time or another have had almost the exact same experience. I once told my husband that for Halloween I wish I could dress up as a Coors light can so he would pay attention to me. How sick is that. The very thing that has ruined his and our lives is the one thing I wish I could have been. Man it is just crazy. I have started listening to Melonie Beattie again on Codependent No More: How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself, the second book of hers. It was wild listening yesterday to it, it is like everything I think or do is just that for or about him or someone else. I really like her as I seem to get exactly what she talks about. My spouse is now going to meet with hospice this Friday. I gave up on trying to pursue it and they contacted him yesterday to set it up. Not looking forward to this next chapter of alcholic reality. I have been going to my therapist and yesterday for the first time I focused on me and setting goals for myself with her to be accountable to so that I would start taking care of myself and remembering that the strong, smart women is stil inside me I just allowed my own sickness and his to bury her away for too long. I am working on trying to no expect anything and accept and surrender to what has become a very sad event for him. But now that it is what it is I know I can and will survive and stive to live out my life as healthy and meaningfull as possible. I did not even know who I was for the last 7 years of my life and now I am taking baby step and detaching with love and not even putting me first, just remembering that I too have a life and am a person of God worthy of being happy and doing the best I can and that it is okay to give myself love too.

  • Laura

    Debbi, It is astonishing how much we can go through and your are really being tasked. I am glad to hear that you may move closer to your family. This may just be what you need to have happen for you. I hope the medical issues get worked out and that your are able to recieve some sort of coverage. Even if you have to go bankrupt over it, as long as you stay healthy even though it seems impossible sometimes you will get through it and life will get better. Many people have had to do that over medical bills and even though it sound hard it is what it is and you are the most important person right now who deserves the best help and support possible you have done it for others long enough. Is there a horse therapy place close to you that may take your horse in or if you can get to a computer can you put a message out on craigslist for help with your horse. Even if you want to keep it maybe someone will take it in for a while to help you out. You sound so strong and I believe that you know what is best for you and will follow your gut with what you need to do. It is time for you to heal and have a chance at being healthy and happy after all you have given. I know this may sound silly but if you like the same authors and speakers that I do I stongly suggest you come up with 1 or 2 mantras or affirmations for you. I know have a healthy and strong body, I love and approve of myself and I am bringing good health into my life or something like that whatever works for you and say it at least a 100 times a day. They say the good energy and healthy feeling we send out through thought and prayer really does change our body chemicals and feeling. I hope you get where I am comming from as it is only intended as a suggestion, since I cannot be there to give you a hug or help you out. Love,Healthy and Peace be with you. L

  • Debbi

    Laura:
    Thanks for your concerns but my “mantra” as you suggested is “I refuse to even think about this anymore”. This area is so depressed and no resources that United Way & others have declared bankruptcy so that leaves the horse & I out on a limb. But I have chosen now that I will remain at peace regardless of the cost. The A that used to be in my life did everything to upset me: nasty comments, jealousy, trying to make me think he was cheating, etc, etc. Most people bailed on me & now I know that this was meant to be–the A, his horrible supporting family, so-called friends that still have not even called to see if I’m still alive are my higher power’s ways of weeding out these awful people from my life & it’s going to hurt for awhile but I have this gut feeling that no matter what these stupid doctors say–I am not only going to live but I am going to thrive–right now I am just being molded into something better & once I’m out of the oven watch out!!!

  • Mia

    Isn’t it sad that when my alcaholic x boyfriend showed up saying he’d has a bike crash and was bleeding my first thought was. I bet you were drunk and fell off or swerved into a parked car and felt no sympathy. My first thought was I wonder if this will make him realise . But no, his story was a car drive too close to him and skimmed so near he list his balance . It’s so sad I’ve changed so much through not trusting a word he says. Once upon a time I would have rushed the man I lived to the sofa and lived him and cared for him. I found myself going through the motions of caring as u could smell the coder and felt angry he totally denied any fault. Maybe they did drive too close but I guess we just don’t know what is the truth anymore just like they don’t. His arm was badly bashed up and very badly swollen but he wouldn’t go to the hospital . Why I said ? He said in strong it’s nothing. But he carried on moaning in pain . I thought , if we went to hospital we’d be waiting ages with no drink to hand. They’d notice too and he’d maybe get tests done that he knows might show something . I’ve become cold to him in someways so detached I don’t make a fuss and so sad he’s so far away from taking any responsibility. Last week he said he wanted to get back together , he’d cut back and get help, and here we are….. I can’t trust a word he says and he can’t be honest yet with himself. Needless to say he proceeded to have a four pack of cider to make himself feel better . When did my life become so far removed from the kind living and happy person I used to be ? I’ve become suspicious, sad and cold to him. Is that detachment or me just becoming a hard cold person ?

  • JM

    Hi Mia,
    No, you are not becoming a hard cold person. You are growing up of knowing that the A can’t be trusted.

    I am in the same situation. I ended relationship with ABF for 8 years recently. I cared for him when he went through cancer recovery. I hoped that he would have learnt, and stop drinking. But no, even during the early stage of the treatment, he picked up his drink, and as usual, drink to drunk every second day.

    Such behaviour broke my heart! I found myself became more and more anger, felt into a black hole with complete darkness surround me.

    Because I didn’t encourage him drinking, He then went to the local pub everyday, drinking, smoking and gambling. Hundreds of thousands dollars has been gambled away, it didn’t seem worry him!

    I thought the break up would help him to hit the bottom. I was wrong. He is so capable of bending the truth and the fact. He blamed me! Sure it was all my fault, because I don’t drink, I don’t gamble, I manage well of my finance to pay the bills!

    I’ve found myself just can’t trust him any more!

    I am no longer sad, no longer hoping he would change. Instead, I’ve found myself lucky that I didn’t agree to share my finance with him, that I now free from his mess!

    Stay strong everyone, it is hard to be calm in dealing with an alcoholic, I hope you do trust yourself and look after yourself.

    Al-anon told me – “It all should pass”, I am counting on it.

  • Mia

    Thank you, I’m really struggling to stay strong . I had such a volley of verbal abuse two nights ago because I said for the hundredth time . We can’t have a relationship until I am more important than your ciders. We can’t have a strong bond until I know you will choose me not a can of cider. The fact that I’m a someone who loves you and you can stand there and say the drunk in the tin can you hold is more important and when that’s in the bin and in you I’m still here but you choose another can tells me you aren’t ready . He screamed such abuse and said its none of my business, how dare I say he’s had too much to drink. I told him it want my business and he could drink as much as he likes . But if he wanted me then its my choice that I can’t live with someone who drinks all day everyday. Sometimes I feel I get back with him just to stop the abusive calls, the drunken visits. When we are apart his drinking spirals way off the scale.

    I’m trying to put a bid in for a new business and he tried to stop me from working on it . I was so excited about it and when I told him he was so negative about an aspect of the process he couldn’t remember the next day what I told him

    He passes out on my soda and claims he’s tired as he’s a labourer. Couldn’t be one if he was a drunk etc etc. fact is though he hides his drink in his bag so he can drink at work and one night last week he passed out on my sofa. The building fire alarm went off and u have to say its the most horrendous ear piercing siren . He didn’t even stir , it even surprised me he must have had far more than he appeared.

    I’m feeling so exhausted drained and emotionally wrecked with this roller coaster of detaching in a way that is serene and not exhausting

    My son who has asperges syndrome has just got back from college and in a very bad way . It’s how he gets when things don’t go well. He’s never around my X as I don’t allow him here when my son cones hone anymore. Anyway he’s in a low place and has just spent his second day home being unbelievably rude and saying very cruel things. He’s 18 now and has his problems and takes it out on me and cos I don’t accept his behaviour and put down boundaries he gets more angry and reclusive

    I feel I can’t cope or go on much longer. I’m no push over. I’m not enabling either of them as I’m blocking them but it is breaking my heart at the love ive had and shown to the most important people in my life is being thrown back and trampled on. What they say is similar, it’s cruel and manipulative . A high functioning alcaholic and a very high functioning asperges lad are a very similar thing

    Maybe that’s why I’ve accepted the alcaholic, it’s so much of what I’m used to

    I don’t know. I’m just so tired and alone and wonder what is the point of going on in my life. It doesn’t matter what I try to achieve I get exhausted and then one of these two men just seem to want to drag me down into their mental pain

    I don’t feel I have any strength left

    This detaching and being firm with boundaries, refusing to fight or have relationship seems to create so much anger in my X that it’s running me into the ground

    I can understand why sone people say they have to move cities or even countries to break free. All the time he knows where I Live or work I will have Ro keep turning hin away and putting up with abuse

    It feels like I will never be free and I feel I’ve nothing left in energy

    I wish I could just go away for a month somewhere I could feel safe and free from this life that is chaotic

  • JM

    One day at a time, Mia. I understand it is hard, it is hard for everyone.

    I am still going through the darkness, as I am still looking for work. But we have to go through it.

    I was like you felt that I got no energy left. I sometimes went out alone to a local park, just laying on the green there for a few hours, close eyes, meditation – deep breath.

    A friend told me, that it is all about the THOUGHTS, that thoughts leads to the FEELINGS, then the BEHAVIOURS. Once I know this circle, I established my awareness, then I accept the fact/reality, then I adjust my behaviours.

    BE positive – it is hard, but the positive thoughts can help you go through the difficult times.

    Don’t let you boundaries loose. Take care of your finance. And take care of yourself first before him.

  • DW

    WOW…I just *stumbled* on this site because I am so tired of being blamed for every single thing that happens in this house. And it is all making more sense to me now. Talk about low self esteem..OMG it is the lowest it has ever been in my entire life. Thank GOD I am a strong woman (and strong willed too) or I think I would have done myself in by now. I am NOT kidding. I can’t remember who wrote above (my apologies) but I left everything. A husband of 27 years (who ended up being a cross dresser and lied to me for 20 years) a beautiful home everything I ever wanted, and what do I do..I marry a severe (as two doctors have told me) alcoholic. That was a smart move…NOT. To top it off, he has terminal prostate cancer. Now any rational human being would be doing all they could to try to stay away from things that will make their illness progress even faster. Nope not in my house..it’s more and more and more. It is sad and hard to watch yet at the same time I am getting bitter and angry at the way I am treated. I have NEVER been a bitter person. I let things slide off my back pretty quick and am quick to forgive, but day in and day out something new comes a long. The secrets, the lies, the manipulations, the blame game etc etc ect and I am so freaken tired of it. I am a woman of faith and can not tell you how many times in a day I cry out to the Lord and ask for strength to get through this. He is on 13/15 meds a day, plus has copd/emphysema and other things going on as well. This is such a toxic relationship and I can honestly say some days I love him to death and others it won’t come soon enough to be free of all of this pain inside. It is so hard and I applaud all of you for the walk you are walking and trying to keep your head above water..You all are my hero’s…Thank you!

  • Karen2

    Welcome, DW. Glad you found us.

  • DW

    thank you…I’m glad too…such a sad broken place to be within our relationships and hearts and minds…

  • Debbi

    Hi DW:
    Everyone’s story here has all those similarities but each time I see a new post with another person in turmoil with what they are living with my heart goes out to them. You certainly are a strong person to be living with this. You will find some amazing people here always willing to listen and extend help. You can and you will get through this. Stay in touch & my thoughts are with you!

  • Pez

    Welcome DW. You can vent here, ask questions, or for support and recommendations for those who have been through this, and some still trying to escape the pain of betrayal and cruelty. We are here for you~!

  • Ben

    Hi DW – welcome. I am saddened to hear about your situation. I also lost a lot- had sole custody of my three beautiful daughters, friends, a nice house full of furniture, active church life, living family, etc. I found what I thought to me the missing piece- someone to be a role model for my girls and complete our family. Her kids took off. My kids took off. She poisoned my dad’s last year on earth, I sold all that furniture, I had to take a title loan out on my Infiniti to pay for a custody battle w her ex because her kids wanted to live w their dad due to her alcoholism and related “bitchiness”, my paid off Infiniti got repossessed, I lost everything- all my friends, everything. In the last 5 years I have reestablished. However, I did so in spite of her alcoholism.

    I guess my perspective on your situation would be this: and may God help me, because I don’t want people jumping down my throat here:
    If he’s not going to quit drinking, maybe it’s best he passes on. God is throwing you a lifeline here, why are you questioning it? While I worry about my wife’s health I have always thought if she doesn’t get better cancer sooner rather than later would be best for all three of us (her, my daughter, myself) to gain peace. Lets face it, alcoholism has a 17% recovery rate- which means 83% die. Those 83% are someone’s husband, wife, mother, etc. My prayer would be for him to enjoy the time he has left and not suffer.

  • Meg

    be encouraged, its tough but there is hope

  • DW

    Thanks guys for your encouraging words. Ben I feel for you as well, and I hope no one jumps down your throat. It’s a tough road we are on all of us and we are on it for one reason or another..maybe to find the strength in us that we didn’t know we ever had, maybe it is for us to lean on the Lord more…(which I certainly do). He will never quit drinking..perfect example. He started at 10 am yesterday and at 7pm he wanted to drive a half hour away to get something to eat. I said well it’s getting cold, can you handle eating inside without having a beer..he said NO can we eat in the car..I said NO and I am not going in your car with you if you are driving. Sad to say but if he left this house I would have called the sheriffs because last night he would have killed someone or himself driving and that is total BS. Course I had to put up with the I’m fine to drive what are you talking about crap. I said you know what buddy…look in the mirror…that is the person you can blame not me. And I went to bed. He is I think I mentioned terminal they have given him one to three years…he has past the one year mark and is rapidly declining. Although he is still up and moving around the most exercise he gets is bringing a beer to his mouth God knows how many times a day. For the most part I stay to myself, or on weekends I’ll catch up with some friends who are musicians and go hear them or whatever with other friends. I may have one when I am out and nothing ever at home, he has taken that social part away from me because it disgusts me now…and that is probably a good thing. I am learning so much about how our thoughts effect us and we become our thoughts..I am not buying into that. I am not going to become a poor whaoa’s me woman who is dependent on an alcoholic…no way no how…we are transformed by the renewing of our minds and trust me, I am renewing my mind almost every day. But in and through all of this he is my husband I am not breaking my vows I do love him and I am going to see him through all of this and take as many breaks away from him as I feel I need to. And that is the key here…TAKE BREAKS take time for YOU…only YOU can help YOU no one else can. You can wallow in it and in self pity or get up and get moving and do things outside of the house. Do I worry when I am out of the house…darn straight I do..especially if it has been a long day of drinking I hope I come home to my house and not it burned down to the ground. But if it does I have a clear heart and know that I know in my heart of hearts I am doing what is best for me while trying to do the best for him. Make any sense?

  • Ben

    DW- you sound so strong. I cannot make time for myself at night because that would mean leaving my toddler alone with her, and that is simply not safe. Last week she fell asleep and forgot the stove on and we could have all been killed over some stupid home made apple butter that got thrown out anyways. Sunday night she tried to give our daughter a bath in the whirlpool and only turned on the hot water- she almost lowered Olivia into 75 gallons of 190 degree water. I do try to take livi to awana Wednesday nights, but I also feel bad for her because she’s in kindercare 60 hours a week while Nikki sits home and drinks.

  • DW

    I can understand your frustrations Ben…but what about Grandparents, Aunts and Uncles you need a break too. Dos your wife not want any help does she not want to stop even for your little girl???

  • DW

    oops sorry about the spelling *does* I meant to write. Sometimes, in situations like that especially where there are children involved you may have to walk away. Thankfully my kids and his kids are all grown up with their own kids so there aren’t any children in our home or I would have left him in a hummingbirds heartbeat..

  • Ben

    Hi DW- no, we moved to minnesota and do not have any relatives. I cannot make friends because she doesn’t like friends. She doesn’t want anyone in the house ever. She just wants to be locked in the house drinking.

  • DW

    They have to be held accountable no matter what the cost…and unfortunately it is them that chose the alcohol over all else, it is their god and their best friend. But…what does your daughter need? Something mommy can not give her right now…and mommy needs to understand and realize that her daughter has her whole life in front of her and it may have to be without the alcoholic Mommy..

  • DW

    Ben, have you ever considered getting some outside help possibly speaking with some one at AA who can refer you to a support group? I haven’t been to one myself, but from what I hear they can be very supportive and helpful. This is no way for your daughter to grow up and maybe you should go ahead and make friends for yourself and invite them over…let her be embarrassed a few times and see if anything changes. Of course make your friends aware of this. You can’t do this alone without support. That is like giving her your life and saying ok do what ever you want to me…no that is not how it works. We have a habbit us humans of being enablers because it is easier for us to avoid the situation. Thus we not only become enablers, but avoiders as well. This is such a crappy situation all around for so many people..yet the one who is doing the drinking is totally oblivious to the harm and hurt they are causing others because of their own selfishness. Just plain sucks…

  • Ben

    DW,

    You bring up a good point. However, after waking up at 5 am, getting ready, getting livi ready, dropping her off, driving to work, driving back, picking her up, it’s 6:00 pm and I’m wiped out. It’s hard to live “outside of your house” because home is not safe. I am thinking about permanently moving down to our finished basement though. However, livi sleeps between us and it affects her badly- she’s all about the three of us and family. Sadly, she adores her mom and doesn’t realize how messed up this situation is- it has become her new normal.
    Don’t you love this site? You’re new- were supposed to be ministering to YOU :).

  • DW

    LOL…I think we are supposed to minister to each other and lift one another up…I can understand..your daughter is very young and I admire you for taking such good care of her and your family. Maybe get her into some kind of Sunday School on Sunday Mornings there are so many outlets there where she can start going to kids groups and on adventures too that would be fun for her and give her some stability in all of this, and it would give you a little break too. Or even go to a service yourself and meet some like minded folks who can minister to you and pray for you and be there for you. You need to surround yourself with positive people and prayer warriors. Don’t mean to get preachy here, but truly if it weren’t for my prayer warriors behind the scenes, I would be a complete mess. And that..is the truth 🙂

  • Karen2

    Heya Ben, Glad to hear from you, it’s been a couple of days. I have you on my mind a lot these days. You see, I have 2 grown sons whose lives were sliced, diced and shredded by their women early on (not alcoholics). I can’t help but hear them when I read your posts. Anyway…I also have 2 daughters; one is 13, the other is 15, today. So when I read about Livi, I understand your dilemma well. Unfortunately, during my worst years with alcoholism, my little girls were in the cross hairs. So if you have any questions that you would like to ask, I’ll do my best to answer you honestly.
    BTW, Minnesota? North Carolina!

  • Mike

    Keep God close, because you will need Him.
    Ups and downs.

  • Ben

    Hi Karen!!!! I didn’t think you were relaxing on the beach anywhere around here! Lol. Thanks for all your help- yes, if you would be kind enough to respond to the shaking post regarding her work and nursing, that would be great. I sense trouble in paradise – she has ICU training the next couple of months and the educator called her and expressed concern- seems like a couple of the other girls took information from the SIM back to the educator at the hospital she works at. I’m sensing other nurses are picking up on things? She says its because she gets nervous and turns red when she is the center of attention and when they did the code sim, she was center of attention and she hates that, voiced it, and it got back to the educator. I’m thinking that’s a smoke screen. They either noticed her behavior is off, she’s off, or maybe that she’s running to her car at lunch time, something.

  • Ben

    I did that at a large church here. I put her in contact with the leader of our addictions ministry who is an ex alcoholic himself. After knowing him for a year, she turned him against me AND got me kicked out of small groups. The reason? That our relationship is so toxic they don’t want to be a part of it. How does that work? I’ve been a Christian all my life. My mom worked at Moody Bible Institute, I’m a proud member of the Stryper fan club :), yet she gets me pretty much kicked out of church and back into isolation.

  • DW

    Well Ben, it sounds as though Jesus himself would not have been welcomed at that church…God is going to put you where HE wants you and where HE will use you. Don’t give up hope on that…GREATER is HE that is in us than he that is in the world and this is a very dark place to be in as a follower of Christ. I know. I taught Sunday School for many years, played the piano/keyboard on worship teams for many years and I really really miss that..and the pot lucks too 🙂 But seriously we wrestle not against flesh and blood and I am reminded of that constantly…and possibly it is not my husband God wants to change..I may be here because He wants to change ME…now that is humbling..

  • DW

    By the way…my name is Dale…the female version of the name…and in my later years after losing my father, I am now thankful to have his middle name 🙂

  • DW

    Some days it is so hard working through anger and bitterness…like tonight for an example…I don’t even want to look at him, or talk to him. I went to bed early and he came in and put his arm around me, so I got up. I don’t even want him touching me. How do you guys work though that?

  • Debbi

    To Ben: I too was not welcome in my own church after my exAH blackened my name & he did not even go to church. I figured if they believed lies at that church I want no part of it and I left. Find another outlet Ben.

    Do DW: I understand what you mean about not wanting to talk to or be touched by them since they treat you so bad after awhile their futile attempts at intimacy are a disgrace–you are doing the right thing, leave the room. If he does something that makes you uncomfortable, you do not have to stay there, move away and end the conversation.

  • DWere

    Thanks Debbi….the whole thing with his alcoholism is also the prostate cancer where he has been chemically castrated and has no interest in me whatsoever but has no problem looking at other women either on the internet, in person no matter where we are and that is humiliating. I see so much now from reading a lot on here. The blame game he is always blaming me for things and conveys as much to his one sister. It is so funny because last week he said I am two different people. I had to lol because he is the one who has two personalities..sober and drunk. I see him sober for maybe if I am lucky 2 hours in the morning and I hesitate even saying sober as he still wreaks of the night before. He told his doctors that he drinks between 90 and 120 beers a WEEK and that is no lie, at least he was honest about something!!! The doctors don’t even mention his drinking to him because he is terminal so they keep quiet about it. This is so very frustrating. We have been married two long ugly years. Yes I knew he drank however I had NO idea until we were married how much he drinks. He has two cups of coffee in the morning, does not eat all day, has a little bit of dinner and drinks well into at least 11 or midnight non stop. He goes to the store, he brings beer with him. The other night he wanted to go to get a burger. I said can you handle eating inside and having a soda and he said no we can eat in the car. I said are you freaken kidding me???? 15 minutes really??? So I said well, no thanks I am not going. I have no idea what I am doing here, every day is a new thing and honestly if he didn’t have cancer I would have run away so fast. He has no respect for me as a woman whatsoever, no affection AT all…some friends have told me to go *outside* of the marriage…no thank you I don’t need or want that guilt or more confusion in my life…Never in my life have I seen a therapist, but I have been…an very old and dear friend..she has talked to her colleagues and one in particular has been involved with alcoholics for 30+ years and said I am living with one of the severest alcoholics he has come across…well that just makes me feel special….I pray without ceasing for God to get me through another day and to please, take this bitterness and anger away from me…this is rough to say the very least!

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