When to Close the Door on Cheating, Romance and Alcoholics

open door bright lightFrom: Jim
Hello everyone. I happened on this site, alcoholicsfriend.com, perchance after viewing several YouTube videos concerning alcoholism and relationships. I must say it is a diamond in a sea of rough.

My name is Jim, I’m a 33yo male, educated, and hold a professional position in the technology field. According to my friends, I’m a contrast of sorts—extremely technically and logically oriented, yet I don’t possess the typical “IT guy” persona as it appears to my feelings, socializing, and getting my own self out there. I love people.

My story begins 13 years ago when I met, who I thought, was my soul mate—a girl that made life worth living. I was young, 20, had never really experienced love or life before, but felt all of the passion and convictions associated with it. It felt real. We fell quickly in love, before ever truly getting to know each other. Engagement quickly came, followed by a breakup, followed up by reuniting… A pattern began to emerge.

Over the years, our personalities developed as we matured through our early to mid 20’s, towards our 30s. Over those same years, as quickly as we fell in love, we fell out of love.

About three years ago, under very extreme circumstances, we were both unfaithful to each other. Both of us cheated. The bond of trust enjoyed for so many years was shattered.

Over the next 2.5 years, our relationship flattened out. We tried moving, buying homes, starting over… all temporary Band-Aids. Trust was gone. From there, we tried therapy a number of times, talking at length about “why” everything happened, things just weren’t the same.




We became roommates. Love was truly gone. Being that this is all I knew, this girl who I met over a decade before, I almost accepted this was my life. Game over.

All of this changed for me last Christmas season at a work function, our annual Christmas party. During the course of the night, I ran into a co-worker I sort of knew… she had worked with us about two years ago, left for another position, and then recently came back and accepted a new position within our organization. By chance, she decided to come to the Christmas party and socialize with her co-workers. Once the function ended, a group of us decided to retire to a local bar across the street for a drink prior to going home. We invited her group of friends to join us… the more the merrier. I fell into a conversation with this girl… a mesmerizing and tantalizing discussion about so many topics. We were spot on in agreement throughout it all. We complemented each other perfectly. During the course of the night, her words echoed inside my heart unlike I had ever heard before. I finally felt the parts of myself dormant for years with the girl I started dating 12 years before, come alive again. It was a truly uplifting experience. She felt the same way.

In short order, over the next couple of weeks, we spoke and hung constantly. There was never any inappropriate behavior or actions between us. She was also in a multi-year relationship with someone, and we had both committed to ending one chapter of our life before beginning another, the right way. . Things were so perfect between us in every conceivable way; we both knew what we had to do. By the time New Years rolled around, we jointly walked away from our lives to be together.

Now the fun, romantic dating times began…. At first, everything was absolutely perfect. We were inseparable. Every discussion was magical; every dinner date was perfect—sharing a single glass of wine, etc. There were no drunken times. About a month into our relationship, I was supposed to meet her for dinner at a steak house. As dinner time rolled around and I sat at the restaurant waiting, I began to worry. Calls and text messages went unanswered, etc. At no point did I assume alcohol was involved, I thought something happened to her! I left. A few hours later, she returned my call… said she needed a ride home and had lost her keys. Upon picking her up (from a bar), it was clear she was extremely intoxicated. I got her home safe and wrote it off to just a bad night, stress, family issues, etc.

The problems began to multiply–more of the same over the next few months. It was not as consistent as many of you experience, purely random, but I began to notice patterns in her behavior changing. She went from being the kind, outgoing, caring girlfriend who loved to just spend time holding my hand as we strolled through a neighborhood park, to someone who would ask me, “can we stop for a drink?” almost every time we would see each other without specific plans. At this point, we were still together 3-4 nights per week. When I began to take notice of this, and comment, “why?”, or ask her “can we have a night where we don’t drink?” she would get very quiet and almost bored with the evening…oddly, never disagreeing or forcing alcohol to enter the evening, but just elsewhere in her mind.

At the same time, several months into our relationship, she would exhibit mysterious behavior. For example, almost every time I would call her, she never answered, and would always call me back. I noticed her begin calling in sick at work randomly. Her availability seems to drastically decrease the more I mentioned she potential problems with alcohol.

The LIES began. She began to lie to me about people she would see, places she would go, and things she would do. In the next month or so, it became almost comical in a sad way just how poorly constructed some of these lies were. Still thinking this was the girl of my life, the girl whom I left everything I had known as a adult for 12 years, I felt horrifically depressed, sad, and I wanted ANSWERS. Being the dedicated and energetic boyfriend I am, I sought those answers out by showing up randomly at her house, (she, like I, had moved back in with our parents after we left our ex’s to be together), checking the local bars for her car, driving around for sometimes hours trying to find out where she is, every time she would just ignore me randomly. In doing so, I figured out a number of things … at one point, she was still hiding the fact she was going out drinking with her ex boyfriend (a guy who has never truly accepted their relationship was over), drinking excessively almost 5-6 nights a week, and calling into work to begin drinking at 10 or 11 in the morning.. At night, she would go out randomly, tell me she was her mother shopping, or some other story, and then call me several hours later while driving, completely intoxicated. This lead to many fights.

About a month ago, I tried to have a heart to heart conversation with her. I laid out my feelings, although admittedly I am capable of saying things that do nothing but make the situations worse, as I have never dealt with alcoholism before. I explained how her lying and drinking are directly related to trust for me, and I’m worried it is all but gone here. What can we do, if anything, to try to resolve this? I spoke about my love for her, about how much we both did in terms of changing our lives to be together, and felt we were getting close to a solution. She admitted she doesn’t know why she drinks, she doesn’t know when to stop, and writes a lot of this off as her having fun in her young years. She is 29. In her mind, as soon as she settles down and gets married, or plans to have children, the drinking will just stop. Again, not knowing how to deal with someone like this, I tried to give her the benefit of the doubt. As much as struggle with trust from my past relationship and now this one, I want to be in love. I am the type of person who feels the need to take care of their special someone. I think I’m a fixer when I know no one can fix alcoholism until the person with the disease wants to fix themselves.

Over the past month, her drinking has gotten worse. She writes it off to stress, or minimizes it… or flat out denies it. When I would see her, almost every time, I would smell alcohol on her breath… no matter what time of day. Most days I would be too ashamed to mention it and tried to ignore it. This has been a very difficult month for me. Her drinking seems to be accelerating to almost every day now… sometimes 5-6-7 days in a row. I only know about this from when I see her, she will hardly ever drink around me, but is perpetually late when we do have things to do, always showing up 30 minutes behind and smelling like alcohol.

Last weekend, things exploded when we went to a big musical festival together, spent the weekend at a nice hotel to catch the concerts, and I caught myself checking her cell phone and finding proof of her ex still trying to communicate with her, despite her telling me (and him), she wanted nothing to do with him. I want to believe her, but knowing how closely tied alcoholism and lying are together, I just can’t. We fought for a few days, with her always trying to steer the arguments away from her behavior and her drinking to my actions… placing the full blame on me.

She claims she’s afraid as far as this relationship; her biggest fear here is that the fighting will never go away. I try to tell her my attitude and sometimes anger is directly related and in response to her actions… the drinking, the lying, and the mysterious behavior that seems to follow all of this around. Despite that, she claims she wants to be happy in life, and just enjoy things… yet wants to be serious in a love-providing relationship with someone? She said she needs a break from me and my obsessive nature. One month. Prior to storming off, she said I should call her in one month when I figure myself out. ????

I am thoroughly confused. I thought people who try to care for the ones they love and prevent them from hurting themselves were good people, not bad. At this point, several days have gone by where she has flat out ignored me.

A couple of days ago, after finding this site and reading MANY of the articles and your stories, I tried to text her asking her if we can talk, no arguments. I felt I have some new tools available to me to deal with some of this behavior and am eager to try it out.

Long, long, story short, what the heck do I do now? In talking to my closest friends, they are in agreement – they feel this relationship isn’t worth my time, the new $300k house I just bought and want to find someone to share it with, shouldn’t be her. They feel I am wasting my effort, worrying about someone who just wants to have fun, who is self-fish, has substance abuse issues, and sees me as the kind of person who will always be there for them. They advise me to forget about her as soon as possible. I don’t know if I can do that though, I am truly someone who doesn’t invest in someone else like this unless my feelings are real… through thick and thin, I don’t commit to someone lightly, nor can I walk away easy….

Despite the fact we have been together for 7 months, aren’t married, and have no children, it isn’t easy for me to walk away when my heart still belongs to this girl, even with her problems… I want to help. There is a very special person in there who has everything I wanted in a life partner, a wife, but trying to find those elements in a sea of whiskey and beer is not easy. What should I do? As I titled this story, When Is The Right Time to Close the Door?

Thank you all, especially you JC, for this website. Your lessons are already affecting me in a positive way.

Jim from Chicago

174 comments to When to Close the Door on Cheating, Romance and Alcoholics

  • Pez

    Linda, No matter how hard it is you need to keep ties cut!! No contact! Keep yourself busy and find new interests other than him! After 33 years he has you pegged. I know it’s hard but you must for yourself and your own pride.

  • linda

    Thanks pez
    Just got off phone with my cousin -to thank her for the year away from this craziness. U are exactly Wright no contact. That is were I made my mistake. This was his way to try and drive me totally crazy. Not going to let him. I’m so sick of him projecting his crap on me.

  • Linda

    Pez
    Thanks Pez, Wish I would have seen it When he said He what’d to work things out. That was truly a lie. marriage counseling only showed him what hurt me, so the A does it all the more. Can leave me with this anxiety . Thinks I going to fall for his set-up. To confront her. Gas lighting just gets worst. This was his plan to get me to come back. To prove their statement that I was Crazy! His and girlfriend I call work wife. This A is very smug, His goal is to hurt me………Action speak louder then his words!!!!!!!

  • Olga

    Confused!! I have been married to my husband for just under two years and while he does not drink quite so frequently as some of the other partners, I do not regard his drinking as normal. The alarm bells for me is the fact that he doesn’t seem to care one little bit how much his drinking affects our lives and our relationship. The last week has been a nightmare! This episode started last Friday and I am still suffering the consequences. Basically, the way he works involves doing a lot of sleep ins (care industry) so some weeks I don’t see him much… and I miss him! Last Friday and prior to last Friday I asked him several times NOT to drink in the afternoon and not to be drunk when I came home, as I REALLY wanted to have a nice weekend with him… my plan was to go into town have a meal, enjoy a cuddle or two and spend a leisurely Sat morning with him.. lazy morning, lovely breakfast etc… I had it all plan. The reason I had to beg is because this is a regular accurance! When he has a day off and some money in his pocket it seems inevidable 🙁 Anyhow I came home on Friday at 4pm and he was drunk…. weekend destroyed… we argued to the point of exhaustion, and with the promises and the unpleasantness I thought he would surely not do it again the next day he was off… On the Tues he came to collect me in his car from work… I suspected he was drinking… He wasn’t drunk, but I suspected he was drinking… When I quizzed him on it he left in the car, blaming me for nagging and went drinking.. Thank GOD I found him and was able to take the car keys off him, but that did not stop him…. He phoned later so drunk that he didn’t know where he was or how he was going to get home! Since then, he has been withdrawing from me.. he apologised, but since I took away his money source I seem to be the worst in the world… thinking of leaving him… soooo confused and need advice…. He doesn’t drink all the time, or doesn’t always get drunk, so I don’t know what I am truly dealing with.. please help

  • Debbi

    Question For JB:

    If what you say is truth that alcoholics exhibit traits of other mental disorders–does it eventually stop when they stop drinking or have they altered their brain & thinking permanently?

    I also have another question if you don’t mind. One year since my divorce from XAH and I continue to have things happen to me that I believe is coming from him (forwarding my mail & breaking into bank accounts). If in all the years I knew him, he was unable to even operate a computer–is he learning something new or was he always able to do these very difficult tasks and kept his knowledge of this a secret from me. Are A’s able to learn difficult new tasks while still addicted? Have you seen any evidence of this? And if so, why are they not able to see their behavior with others while drinking and change it if the answer is yes they learn new things while still under influence of their addiction. Hope you have seen evidence of behavior you can answer my questions.

  • Sarah

    Olga — I do not think the issue with problem drinkers or alcoholics is how often they drink, it is how destructive their drinking is to themselves, their lives and the lives of the people that live with them. You should stay on sites like this and go to Al-anon. Don’t involve yourself in his drinking, or going after him, or tracking him down. Protect yourself financially and start focusing on living a life that is full without him. He will either see what he is choosing and missing and try to change, or he will not. In any event, once you start making yourself strong and independent of his drinking you will be okay either way he chooses. If you make nice plans and he is drinking, then have a nice time anyway on your own, or with family and friends. That’s my advice. It is harder, especially when you start getting wrapped up in trying to prevent his drinking or control it in any way. It uncontrollable and if you try to extract promises and control over it, you will be left feeling unworthy, inadequate, lonely, and rejected. So try not to.

  • Olga

    Thank you Sarah… I appreciate your advice. He has been in a ‘grump’ the last couple of days and I have chosen not to react… this has helped a bit I hope as this afternoon I had a firm chat with him and set some boundaries. I love him, but I am prepared to get out of this relationship if this behaviour continues. I’m pregnant which has helped to focus my mind because our child deserves better, and because I do love him… I do believe that if he isn’t an alcoholic yet, he is on the slippery slope and if I don’t take a stand now it will not help either of us. He seemed calm when I spoke to him this afternoon, and he made another ‘promise’. I will wait and see how this pans out and move out (if even only for a short period of time) the next time I come home to him drunk in the afternoon…. it’s no secret, he knows full well… that it upsets me every time.. the next time I am heading straight to a friend or B&B and he can wallow! This site is really helping… I feel stronger already… I was beginning to feel that I was the bad guy… I’m not… it is not reasonable for anyone to have to endure this kind of behaviour and complete disregard. x

  • Sarah

    Olga — I had a whirlwind “soulmate” relationship with my alcoholic boyfriend,where I was pregnant after only a month of dating. We had been communicating by letters and phone calls for six months prior, where we “fell in love” and then were together in person a month before I was pregnant. His drinking was worse and worse and my whole life became that and our daughter. I never had lived or dealt with an active alcoholic before, and I slowly became very codependent myself. I am only now pulling out of it.

    What I find is that someone who is that devoted to alcohol has no room to fully love anyone. You are not the bad guy unless you allow yourself to be. That is what I am learning in al-anon. Not to give in to my anger and rage by insulting or yelling or belittling, or even babysitting him. I need to let him be. But have my own boundaries and standards that make me a better stronger person.

  • JB

    Hi Debbi:
    When I left the alcoholic in my life, he seemed to be functioning better for awhile. He gained some new skills and got a new job (he was also terribly helpless on a computer and other matters). I think it is more the codependency and our “caretaking” as partners that keeps some of them acting helpless and seemingly unable to accomplish small tasks for themselves. As codependents, we learn to anticipate the alcoholics every need, rendering them helpless. An alcoholic will function quite well, especially in his career up until the very end. For men, the career is usually the last thing to go, as so much of their manhood and identity is wrapped up in being a breadwinner and having a job. A lot of times it will be the employer threatening consequences that will finally get the alcoholic to stop drinking. Even after the wife, family, etc. has already left.

    It is totally dependent on the individual as to how much brain damage they do to themselves. During active addiction, the brain is held hostage by the disease and the alcoholic has no insight and cannot learn from their mistakes that are the consequence of drinking. This is the denial and it is just a hallmark of addiction. It makes insight into drinking behavior totally impossible.

    Please please please watch the documentary Pleasure Unwoven: http://www.amazon.com/Pleasure-Unwoven-Explanation-Disease-Addiction/dp/B003AC98V2

    You can also find it in segments on YouTube. I teach introductory psych and require my students to watch now. It explains in easy to understand terms the brain illness and effects of alcoholism and explores the philosophical question of whether addiction is a disease or choice. You will get a lot out of it and it will allow you to feel compassion for the alcoholic in your life. But remember that to feel compassion does not mean we need to put ourselves in a position to keep getting hurt if the alcoholic continues to drink. This is an important distinction that I still have trouble with sometimes. Forgive and move on for your own sake and your own happiness, but you certainly do not have to put yourself in harms way or accept unacceptable behavior. If this means leaving, go. Everyone has to come to their own decisions with this illness, but there is no reason to be unhappy in this life. How you find that happiness and work through the current problems is up to you!! Hope this helps 🙂 I get so much out of reading everyone’s stories and it certainly helps to be reminded that this is an illness and my situation is not unique. We can all see each other’s stories through one another.

  • Olga

    Sarah… I think that was my turning point…. when I had a chance to reflect on how angry, suspicious and mistrusting I have become… After last Friday evening I got so angry at one point I was afraid of myself.. he kept taunting and taunting and pushing and pushing… He pulled everything he could out of the bag… I hate being like this I am actually an easy going person.. He is NOT going to take my sanity, and I am not bringing a child into this… I know it will be a struggle if I am on my own, and I may have to make some big changes, but I would rather do that and have peace. He tried to say again today when I spoke to him that I pushed him to it!! I said ‘NO’ absolutely not!!! It is just not normal! Couples argue all the time, and they might even go for a run or a walk or a pint, but to take the car and come home blinding drunk!!!!! NOT normal… I really hope I can stay tough! I do love him and I want to remain married to him and I want a solid family life for our child… but I can watch myself turn into a freak! x

  • Olga

    **cannot watch myself turn into a freak…. oooops

  • Olga

    Sarah… ours was a little whirwind like also… We were married within 9 months of meeting…. and much of it has been great… on many levels we are soul mates… its just this thing… I hope and pray to GOD he can see the light and beat this thing… I hope it’s not too late and I hope it is not alcoholism per se but just problem drinking. 🙁

  • Sarah

    Olga — I am so proud of the insight you have. I wish I had had it much much earlier. My sweet little 3 year old has been a witness to many, many awful fights between her dad and I, and seen her mom broken down and sobbing. Sometimes the postpartum and the stress were so much I didn’t want to go on. I am finally pulling out of it now. I too love him and I never married him! I told him I wouldn’t marry him until he had a year of sobriety. I work in the legal profession in family law, and I should have known better. But it’s proof that this dis-ease is so powerful and cunning and really aims for those of us with the biggest, most easy going, loving hearts. I too was easy going and not a jealous person. I don’t even recognize the person I am when I am with him.

    I won’t pay for him. I won’t live with him. I won’t let him put me down, and I will not put him down any more. I will not control him or chase him or beg him. I will not give him money to live on, or buy alcohol with. I will not support him and make a home for him, if he is unwilling and unable to support us and provide stability.

    Those are my boundaries. They are not easy. But I find that it gives me dignity, and allows me to respect him more when I am not caretaking him and requiring him to be a good partner before he builds a home. If he cannot, or finds someone new, I will live. It’s kind of like I can’t love him like this, and I don’t respect his choices and the hurt they cause, so I should let him go with love. If he can find love elsewhere then good for him. If I don’t keep this mindset, I will become angry and bitter and that is the one person I have never been and don’t want to live my life being. It is a battle though, because I love to wallow in my bitterness about all the ways I have been harmed and used. But al-anon is helping me to see my part in that too. Sometimes I hate al-anon!

    Set your boundaries now before your baby gets there. Learn to detach as much as possible and let go of the anger before your baby gets here, because that can poison everything for that baby. These are things I wished I could have done sooner, but I have been muddling my way through as best as I can.

    The alcoholic thrives on your anger. If you feel anger then at least it’s something. Ignore that. Let them go with love and maybe indifference. That will be more of a wakeup then anything, if anything can wake them up.

    I like what someone else wrote on the site is live according to your brain, your heart will follow. You know what you are doing is right, even if it breaks your heart. “Fake it until you make it”. Proven science in all kinds of fields, like depression and anxiety, just do the healthy things for yourself even if emotionally you are not there. Your emotions will catch up.

    Good luck! I know you are strong. I seriously urge you to check out al-anon. Even if you just get a few of the books. They really help.

  • Mike

    Alcoholism resides in he brian where personality is. It is learned and is part of their personality now.
    They have learned to live with it. It goes unnoticed as they have lived with it for years and have learned to fool other as well as themselves.
    It is similar to cancer.
    White cells can kill almost all cancers. The problem is, many cancer cells go undetected by the killer cells and so they grow.
    Alcoholism goes undetected because it is so engrained into the person’s psyche.
    The signs were there, we just didn’t know what to look for. We trusted. We got fooled.
    We have fooled other also. Have we been honest all the time ourselves? No.
    EWere we always honest about ourselves when we started previous relationships?
    Did we present the truth to he other right away? I doubt it.
    That is life.
    Marriage is a serious thing and will test the vows of “for better or for worse.”
    We need to teach people that marriage is for mature people and not a joke.

  • Sarah

    If a person is an addict they are not available for love or to make the MUTUAL commitment “for better or for worse”. They are committed to their addiction. I think lying about personality quirks in relationships are so much different then lying about diseases, and addictions and things that deplete the marriage. What does that mean “marriage is for mature people and not a joke?” Alcoholism is not a joke and raising children or trying to have sanity in an alcoholic marriage is not a joke. Even a recovering alcoholic can be their best selves in recovery, get married and relapse years into the marriage. So even if one waits and learns, addiction can still fool you. Although any addict in recovery learns to value honesty of self and honesty to others first and would probably have been up front to their partner about their addictive past.

  • Olga

    Sarah…. I wish there was a ‘like’ thumb thing on this site… well said… again!

  • brigitte

    Olga, if I knew a year ago what I know now, I would have packed my stuff and left like I always threatened to do but never did because I wanted to believe his promises that things would change. Not once, not twice but plenty a time. I became a crazy person from the alcoholism, I poured alcohol down the sink, I hid car keys away, I searched all over the house for secret stash, I checked up on his cellphone, I ranted, I raged, I fought, I nagged, I belittled, you name it, I did it. I was a very sick codependent person. Then I became pregnant and I truly thought that having a child would make things better and he was so excited and for a while, he behaved but the day my boy was born, my alcoholic husband went on a drinking spree and it didn’t stop. Having a small baby made it worse. I think the excitement, the sleepless nights, a tired grumpy wife and just the general reality of having the responsibility became too much and he went off the rails. This is a 38 year old man we are talking about here, someone who should be mature and responsible. A year later and a lot of frustration and anger and resentment on my side and him partying all hours, he meets someone else who drinks with him and he drops me and his son with no remorse, no apologies. NOTHING!! He just moves on without a care in the world and still accuses me of being the problem. I’ve beaten myself up about how I reacted and what I should have said or could have done etc etc…I am left ashamed and bitter and resentful and sickly codependent. He is not interested in our son who is now two years old and when he has taken him, he just gets drunk while having the kid under his care. Its sickening actually. I go to counselling and al anon to find myself again because I don’t know who I am anymore. All I’m saying to you is to please gain some insight and knowledge into what you are dealing with here. Don’t listen to the empty promises, don’t allow yourself to get sucked into the insanity and lose yourself, don’t allow him to treat you like a doormat. Pack your stuff and go now before the baby is born and get settled and calm because I can honestly say that having a small dependent child on you and dealing with a selfish, uncaring alcoholic at the same time is going to push you over the edge no matter how patient you are and I thought I was a very patient person but your strength will be blatantly tested. I’m all for keeping a family together and that’s why I stayed so long but at what cost?

  • Sarah

    Brigitte — I know what you are going through. Sounds like mine, except baby came so soon and he hasn’t left me for the drinking woman . . .yet. Or maybe he has found her, hard to tell. The hardest part is when the children don’t move them at all. And then you worry about your children growing up with this, and without their parent, and that they will start a cycle that will lead them to their own addictions . . . .My worst fear now! Its like my ex-fiancé became my child, and then I had another. And it is dehumanizing and disrespectful to him to see him and treat him like a child, and for me to have someone in my life who isn’t able to meet my needs in any way. I did all of it. The searching. The pouring. The key hiding. The money hiding. Buying it for him after he begs and begs and begs. Sending him money when he’s on the streets, for things like food and shelter. Putting his needs above everyone’s. Mine, my daughter’s. Everyones.

  • brigitte

    Sarah, that’s exactly how it feels. That you have an adult child to look after who is prone to temper tantrums, rebellions against your wishes which are not unreasonable wishes at all. It is exhausting and it leads to loss of respect for the person you should be loving and cherishing. I’m devastated by all of this and I have such down days about the loss of our relationship because I truly love him but on the pro side, life is a lot more serene. My counsellor told me that he did me a favour and I could not see it at first but slowly I am seeing that by having no contact with him and living my life for me, I’m getting stronger. When I do hear from him via email, I automatically feel anxious and angry by his words which are just so insane. I have to try so hard not to get sucked into his blame game. I hope I never have to deal with such pain like this again in my life

  • Olga

    Brigitte and Sarah sounds soooo familiar my partner is similiar… He doesn’t have temper tantrums per se, but he does frequently behave like a tempestuous teenager who is rebelling against Mum…. I often describe it as exactly that!

    Is there any happy endings on this place? Beginning to get doubly worried now 🙁

  • Linda

    Olga,
    Counseling has tote me that the A gets stuck at the age were they start to drink. My case my A is stuck at age 12. I also see these Temper tantrums, which I feel is also rebelling against their mother. My A would sit and pout also. My A Has been clean for over a year. And I still see these behavior. I believe AA keeps him from drinking ,But the root of the addiction was seen at counseling, and is just to painful to go threw. That’s were My A anger is coming from.

  • Olga

    I’m confused Linda… I don’t know whether I am dealing with a spoiled, tempestuous and immature problem drinker or an Alcoholic… My husband CAN respect limits when we are together… when we go out, I generally like to go home earlier rather than later because I am pregnant and he respects that…. and he doesn’t drink (or if he does not excessively) if he knows he has work the next day…. HOWEVER, we have this long running issue of him drinking to the point of drunkeness on his days off.. I don’t mind him having a bevvie in the evenings on the day off… fair enough… but what is happening is he is starting in the morning and I am coming home from work at 4pm to him drunk!! What am I dealing with.. looking at some of the other posts here… I really don’t know anymore… Is it problem drinking…. Is he a spoiled brat… or is it the beginnings of a serious issue 🙁 x

  • C

    Joel Olsteen (sp?) once said that there are things you will never understand or get an answer to, so you put those thoughts away – and, get on with your life. I remember that whenever I am upset about something I can’t fix like a neighbor’s barking dog, or a childhood memory that upsets me every so often. Also, I know that we only have one life on earth – we are not coming back! I want to enjoy each day and go out of my way to be with those who make me laugh.

    Trying to figure out how to live with an alcoholic will age anyone!

  • Pez

    You would all be so proud of me! It’s been over 3 months since I cut all communication with my XAB. I went grocery shopping at Safeway (I intentionally go there because the X shops at King Soopers so I try to avoid it). In the 4 years I was with him he never went to Safeway. So, I’m in Safeway looking at the vitamins in horizontal isle may I add (one you can’t look right down) and I hear this “Hi Phyllis”. I step out into the lane and it was him. I was so taken off guard I think I acted perfectly. I said, “you have a lot of nerve speaking to me, you fucked me over twice. He said, “well you look good”. I just responded, “don’t ever speak to me again”–very calm and cool but firm. He said ok and walked away. I just wonder if things are going badly with getto woman so was testing it out how I would react to him. Saw my car and came in 5:00 on a Saturday. And yes he was intoxicated. I am proud of myself!

  • Julie

    Awesome job Pez! You are moving forward with your life. God Bless!

  • Julie

    Pez, I read your link to the soiciopath next door and it all makes sense now why my ex ah is doing the things he has been doing even though he is losing his own game. Funny too that my exah was always saying “tired of playing games with you…you’re going down now” I always thought he was accusing me of playing some game but now i realize it was his game and i was merely a player and what he meant was that he was tiring of me because i was not reacting how he wanted so he was going to up the ante and try some other action and change the game to make me jump. Since our divorce he keeps trying to play these games with me but i am not reacting how he wants and he is frustrated. Wow this has been so insightful and now makes more sense that i can see how he is thinking. Thanks for the link Pez.

  • Julie

    JB I read Drinking : A Love Story. really helps to see what is goign on inside the alcoholic’s head. A must read, for sure. Helps with the empathy but also showed me how my exah was different than Carolyn KNapp and why i had to walk away to enable no more.

  • Julie

    Wow Pez when you posted : “He liked the control over me and my emotions and got a rise out of it. I can see just by observation he is empty inside and had to create chaos to feel alive or any emotions.”
    I felt you were talking about my exah. I only realized this wehn i read Lundy Banroft’s book Why Does He Do that? Another great read.

  • Pez

    It is sad isn’t it Julie. When you realize WHAT IT IS and the emptiness of it all for them. They are so, “numbed out” that’s all they have left is to play games and get a kick out of it for just SOMETHING to be able to feel. Tragic. Their view is “I win, you loose” from Empowered Recovery. The truth is we all loose. We, that loved them loose in emotional, mental and physical losses, they loose their HUMANITY, ability to truly love, in essence their life and soul. On the flip side we can recover, have a new healthy relationship, and can be happy in our future. They may not most likely. So Who here is the winner and looser. I say the A looses in the long run and we win. God Help their souls!

  • Pez

    Found this on UTube. Lots on addiction there. I liked this one the best because it’s how my drug days went. I did them in high school to “fit in” but there came a turning point or tipping point where I quit and this happened to him too.
    this guy was addicted to all kinds of drugs and is now a neuroscientist! I tend to agree or lean more towards his views. Later stages are a different story. Just do a search.
    Neuroscientist Marc Lewis On His Drug Addiction

  • linda

    Thanks pez
    Your post give me understanding of this craziness. This is like dealing with a rebellious teenager. This a just gets mad when I don’t react. Won’t set myself up to prove his statement or hers. I’m the crazy one. This is their game plan. Bagger behind close doors. Then say its me. This is how they try and control us.

  • Pez

    yea, realizing the sociopathic view was really an eye opener for me too and just clicked for me on why he was doing the things he did and how he saw me and other “players” on his chess board. Just horrible to see people in that light but that is how they survive and get what they want, by playing games. That insite, I believe, gave me the strength to react correctly in the supermarket to him, although it is painful. I must delete toxic people from my life. They are the only ones who can change themselves and maybe, just maybe my rejection that day will have an impact on him.

  • linda

    Pez
    felt so much better away from this craziness. Need to leave again. With know contact. He is just making me sick. The anxiety is awful today.

  • Pez

    follow you head Linda! your heart will drag u back. accept its over. I know its hard but all trust is gone.

  • Brigitte

    Yeah Linda, no contact is definitely the only way. I learnt that hard rule the hard way. If you want peace and serenity then definitely go no contact and cut all ties. If you carry on playing his game, he will just pull you deeper and deeper into the insanity and you will become sicker. Its the hardest thing I have ever had to do but its all worth it in the end.

  • Gabby

    What all can you do to stop the contact? I have moved out and changed my phone and my ex boyfriend continues to find ways to bump into me with his new girlfriend. I haven’t even been able to remove all my belongings from his place and too afraid to even go back and get them. Some things I desperately want but figure by now he’s probably thrown them out anyway. The pain of him moving on with someone else is horrible but it seems everywhere I go he’s there with his new girlfriend & that makes the pain worse.

  • C

    Gabby:

    If you really want the things you left behind, find someone to go with you to retrieve them. Call the ex and set up a time – get it over. The new woman in his life knows what he is like or she is learning. She will hang onto him even more if she knows there is someone who wants him back. I have been there – the more the ex contacted my bf, the tighter I held onto him.

    There are no winners when the prize is an alcoholic! Move on and celebrate your health and freedom. You will meet someone with a great personality. Get yourself ready!

  • Brigitte

    Hi Gabby, I live in South Africa and we have different suburbs in one whole town so basically when my ex kicked me and the kids out of his house, I had to find a place that would be close to their schools etc.. That made it hard coz we basically live down the road from him. All our mutual friends see him and his new girl at the local sports club often and they all report back to me and I have had to tell them to please not say a word about him to me. I don’t want to know!! It just hurts too bad. I have stopped frequenting any social places where I know he might be and have had to find new friends in different areas to go out with, I shop at different shops now instead of at the local supermarket. Yes, its ridiculous because I spend my time running away from where I might possibly bump into him but it helps me. I have deleted him off bbm and wats app and facebook social networks and will only deal with him via email regarding the kids. If he does send me an email and I don’t like what he has to say then I just ignore it. I so want to respond sometimes to the blame and the finger pointing but whats the use? he is so in denial and will not see what he has done to his family so its no point really. I also have stuff left at “our” /his house and have not want to go anywhere near there to fetch what I need. I have asked a friend too though and he is more than happy to go and get the stuff when I am ready. I can say though that even though its hard work keeping away from this man, I am much stronger emotionally in myself since I have not been interacting with him coz when I was, I always had a lot of anger, anxiety, emotional stress and I cried a lot. He no longer has the power to hurt me anymore and it has helped a lot in letting him go.

  • Brigitte

    Brigitte
    I also learn this the hard way. In are 33 year marriage I have left this A at least three times. This last time was for at least a year. Was doing fine ,till I left his words bring me back in this denial, and lies. He is just out to hurt me. This is the disease. I know now this is what I tried so to get away from. Sick, Sick, Sick

  • Linda

    Pez,
    You are so wright. This dam disease is awful. We give are all, get taken avenge of. lies, and denies. I think sometimes we are sicker then the A. We want soo much for the marriage to work, living on bids and pieces of the A. The A words are empty. remember ACTION SPEAK LOUDER THEN WORDS.

  • Pez

    Gabby, there is nothing you can do about him and what he does you can only change YOU. If they show up or are at somewhere you want to go–Leave if you need to. If you run into them face to face don’t talk to him or respond. It’s all a game to them! If you have not read the link I posted about the “sociopath next door” please DO! It will give you insight on how they look at the world and you! like the ants. DONT GIVE THEM THE SATISFACTION OF SEEING YOU UPSET! just leave. If they try to talk to you do what I did in my above post. Be firm & short in your comment. When I My XBA tried to make contact with me and I said “you have a lot of nerve talking to me, you Fucked me over twice” His face contorted in a many different ways! It was hard for him to process the reality of what he did! and my rejection of him. Then firmly said as he walked away–“don’t ever speak to me again. God knows what was going on in his drunk brain–Denial, Denial, Denial. Be firm. someday we will all get to the point of indifference which is where I was that night. In my mind=your an asshole and a drunk jerk–how dare you!
    Bridgette, you are doing well! Have your friend go get your things if he offered. That is a real friend. See him for what he truly is.

  • Pez

    Another post from Empowered Recovery site stuck with me, “The only way to win against the alcoholics game is adopt something from there own playbook, Cut your emotional losses and depart the field!”

  • Pez

    Actually it was, “Cut your emotional losses, claim Victory and depart the field”! Excellent advice!

  • Sarah

    It is the worst when you have kids. I try to keep the lines of communication open so that maybe, just maybe he will want to be a consistent father to his child. But, no. All he does is call and text and want to see me. And if I say no, he starts telling me I am fat and ugly and old and used up. Or accusing of being a whore in the past, or the current. Then an hour later acting like nothing ever happened and asking to see us. It’s like if he thinks he insults me down to nothing I will be grateful because someone — anyone — loves me. Yuck. I used to love him for the goodness in him and felt he was an underdog that would bloom with patience and understanding. Nope. He likes to threaten my career. Or telling me what an awful parent I am. Of course I try to take the high road and ignore, but eventually he hits a nerve and I insult him back. If I could change my number I would. But keeping the lines of communication open when you have a child is important should the alcoholic (or his family) try to bring an action in court for visitation and custody. If I change my number, I look like the bad guy. Plus I need my number for my career, where I work out of my home. What I have decided to do is keep a log of his texts and calls and if I must I will file for a restraining order to stop the gross mean texts. It is emotionally exhausting even if I don’t read them, just to see him. I can’t wait for stage two of this emotional warfare when he gets a new girlfriend and starts parading her around me and trying to get our daughter for visits with her “new mom”. Grrrrrrrr.

    If anyone reads this pre-pregnancy or marriage to an alcoholic, let me tell you to just run now before a child makes it all too painful and complicated.

  • Linda

    To All,
    The emotional abuse only gets worse, now he is deleting emails from my email, also things missing from the house. Feeding me bullsh** “Its just you and me”. Running out the door to her……

  • Marie

    Pez, your words bring so much comfort and truth to what I’m going have been going through for the past 4 years married to my AH. So last night I wanted to talk about our marriage and that if he really cared about having me around he needed to acknowledge his alcoholism and get help. I started the conversation with kind and gentle words (he’s currently on work travel 4 hours away from our home) by asking him does he want to really work on our marriage and bring peace and love into our home. His response was “I wouldn’t still be around if I didn’t” total turn off for me however I maintained my composer and did not allow anger and anxiety to take over. So I kindly stated my question consist of a yes or a no answer sometimes people stay in places because of comfort so while I know you are still here your actions demonstrate that you are ok with the turmoil in our marriage while I’m not.

    I proceeded to say do you realize that you have a drinking problem you are an alcoholic. WOW I couldn’t believe his response to this one… Ready for this??? He says I am not an alcoholic you’re not always around me to say I drink everyday.. OMG!!! Really hello for the past 4 years I’ve seen him drink everyday all day if it’s not his Crown Royal 750ml in which he has to finish it in one day he goes from a 12 pack of beers or its the 2 six pack of Smirnoff coolers or his infamous twisted teas.. This is his consumption daily but no he is not an alcoholic.. On Sunday Oct. 6 my heart was so broken while I’m cooking breakfast we were conversing and when I turned around to look at him he was trying to put something together and his hands were trembling in such a way that it instantly broke my heart when I asked why are you shaking uncontrollably he said I’m not shaking and no matter how hard he tried to control his hands from shaking he couldn’t.. But yet he says he’s not an alcoholic. This is evidence that he is as alcohol damages your nervous system. Well needless to say the conversation last night lasted for about 10 minutes when he became irritate and proceeded to tell me that I am the problem and that I’m the one who has issues. I immediately said “Thank You” for your time and you have answered my questions have a good night.

    I wish it didn’t hurt this bad but I know with GOD anything is possible to overcome in life. I congratulate those who have had the courage to stick around for 20,30 years etc.. However I’m still raising children 9 and 15 year old from a previous marriage and can’t have live in misery. Let’s not forget that I’ve been putting up with cheating, sleeping out staying out to the sun reaches home before him. And lets not forget I found out that this has been his behavior with his past marriage and his last girlfriend of 4 years poor girl tried to commit suicide several times. And here comes me the “lucky one” he married. Had I known all of this before I would’ve ran for dear life. However I’m not going to beat myself up for trusting and believing the man who charmed me and swept me off my feet to be a man that had morals and values as I did. I am suffering from anxiety, I can’t sleep and I’m so brokenhearted because I trusted him and the fact that I had shared that the horrible experience I had from my previous marriage of 12 years meant nothing to him. He preyed on me and I can’t believe that people are so cruel into wanting to bring a family into their world of misery. I’m struggling now cause his drinking has brought financial strain into the home so I don’t have any money to move out at the moment. I feel like I’m serving a prison sentence having to live like this until with GOD willing tax season.

    I can’t believe that the man who demonstrated love compassion was a great provider and made me feel like I was on top of the world turn into this other person who I don’t know. I guess since we didn’t live together the first two years it was easy for him to hide these things from me. He continued to torment last night through txts saying that I needed to get checked out because I’m the one suffering from bipolar, he said that I needed to stop playing doctor cause I keep diagnosing him with things.. weirdo.. Said that I was unappreciated that he’s been taking care of me and my children for the past 2 years. And that I was the one who’s been unfaithful to him all these years. This accusation of me being unfaithful comes from (June 14, 2013) when I discovered he was seeing a 25 year old woman who he met at a bar around the corner from our home who by the way is married too for a couple of months as it was stated on their emails to each other. I finally had enough of his cheating and I went out with a couple of coworkers and I bumped into someone I used to date about 5 years ago and he saw a picture that was not hidden as I posted it on FB of all of us having a good time. The ironic thing is that we it took him up until last month to even noticed that picture and when he confronted me I told him the truth mind you he called the guy and the guy who also told him the truth about that night was lying according to him because “I have him well trained” wow.. the way his mind thinks is just pure craziness. It doesn’t matter what the truth is because his lies are his truth. I just want to be out of this misery. All these years I’ve been taking his bs and his sorry stories believing him. The sad thing is that I know he could be a great person if he wasn’t controlled my this deadly disease of alcoholism he suffers to from PTS from serving in the military and it doesn’t help that he was raised by two alcoholic parents who mentally and physically abused him either. Again had he been honest like I was and shared all this while we were dating I wouldn’t have been in this predicament. He never even gave me the option to choose whether I wanted to be with someone who had a lot of baggage I feel so violated. I’m so depressed and can’t do this anymore. I will continue to pray to GOD to give me strength and I need to have faith that all things will work out through the grace of GOD. I thank GOD for this site and the stories of many here cause it shows that I’m not the only one going through these horrible things. Thanks to all who share it helps me gain strength and gives me insight on how to deal with my situation. May GOD continue to bless all who are caught up in this cycle of loving someone who suffers from this deadly disease of Alcoholism.

  • Brigitte

    Maria, you HAVE to get out!! Reading your post sounded like my life. OMG! if only I knew a year ago what I know now. Its not too late for you and your kids and I know its hard financially and I did the same, I stayed coz I was scared to leave as I thought I wouldn’t survive on my own with kids but I swear to you, you do. Its not easy and your living standards will drop and you will have some stress (financial) but I can promise you that it is nothing compared to what you are living with now. I feel so much more free and happier than I have in a long time since my ex kicked myself and the kids out. I never saw it initially but I do now and the alcoholic counsellor told me that he did me a favour and she was right!! Take the bull by the horns and do what you have to do coz I can tell you one thing, if hes cheating now like mine did its coz he isn’t happy that you don’t enable him and the minute he finds a new enabler in the form of another woman, he will drop you like a ton of bricks. Kids or no kids involved. They are insincere, their words mean nothing and that was the hardest thing ever that I have had to accept with mine. I loved him unconditionally and I stood by him regardless of the proof and lies that were blatantly staring at me in the face because I wanted so much to believe that things would get better. We mean nothing to them, we are just pawns in their alcoholic game of life. Go onto a site called Sober Recovery and read the sticky called “what addicts/alcoholics do” written by an alcoholic and you will see first hand what you are dealing with. Good luck and take care and my thoughts are with you.

  • Marie

    Thank you Brigitte for your response. That’s what I’m desperately trying to do. Before we met I was single for 7 years just me and my kids my life was peaceful and I wasn’t even thinking about getting into a relationship. It was his charm and the attention he gave me that lead me to thinking that there was still honest and loving me out in the world. I was sucked into his lies and here I am today. I met Dr. Jekyl and Mr. Hide. And yes I did too fall into the trap of believing me but reading all of the stories her including yours have brought the light from the mental games to the lies to putting the blame on us and running to the next woman/man at the drop of a dime.. It’s really scary the way these people act and think – they treat people like objects. I’ve always been independent, I’m a meetings planner and have been at my job for 8 years now and have always taken care of my children, that’s why I was so swept by him because he gave me attention like no other in my life did. It took alot for me to get comfortable with him catering to me and I finally did he also had a problem with my independence always said not all men are alike what I do I do because I love you and come to find out he treated all his women the same way. Boy was I a sucker.. Brigitte I am definitely trying to get out and I know I will because I’m 44 years old and all I want is to regain the peace and serenity that I had before I met him. There is nothing like peace in someone’s life and my life is not up for gambling either. Thank you so much for your kind words and we must continue to support each other through these difficult times. I will check out Sober Recovery. Let’s keep in touch god bless you and your family.

  • Pez

    Do not count on God to save you! God will do nothing for you that you can do for yourself! That would be him enabling US. Marie, start searching your options housing, financial assistance, Jobs, support from anyone, ect…..Start preparing for that check to come! With your husbands background of alcoholic parents and abuse–this is deep Marie, very deep! There is a alternate saying, “Good things come to those who take ACTION (instead of wait)” I like that :-).

  • Pez

    And, one of the hardest things to see is that we were scammed! To look ourselves straight in the eye and say, “We fucked up”. We did. I know most of us were innocent from the start and now we are getting educated. But, did we demand that they prove themselves early on in the relationship or did we stick it out far too long. I did, out of love for this man that did not deserve my love or a second chance. I have leaned a hard lesson I will not have to learn again! I have just forgiven myself for being a sucker and giving in to my womanly loving caring nature. I have accepted I have been in denial myself for far too long. I am stronger now and know what to look for and what not to accept in the name of love.

Leave a Reply